“Feeling Hate in its Natural State” – Your Wednesday Evening Hate Week Open Thread

Hi everyone, and welcome to night three of [DFO] Hate Week.

Tonight’s a Very Special Night, as this evening is dedicated to Dok Zymm and her hatred of all things Shanahan.

My mind changed on how to do this over the course of the week.

Do I follow the original plan of presenting two men from the same era? It’s a nice pattern, and consistent with what I laid out opening night.

I could just focus on Mike Shanahan alone. There’s enough there on his own to fill an entire post.

Or should I do what tWBS would have done – just take a big ol’ hit and just do whatever

the fuck

I want?

I believe we all know the right answer here.


Marty Schottenheimer

I do want to kick off with something nice. While it might go against the spirit of Hate, it serves the purpose by making the other subjects look that much worse.

And isn’t that why we’re here?

Marty Schottenheimer was one of the last “old school” head coaches. He played in the old AFL, the NFL, and the WFL between 1965-74. He began his NFL coaching career in 1975 as a linebacker coach for the New York Giants, and then was linebacker coach and defensive coordinator with the Detroit Lions. He was also defensive coordinator with the Cleveland Browns when, midway through the 1984 season, Schottenheimer was named Head Coach for the Browns, a job he held until 1988. During those four years he began a tenure of playoff infamy that haunted his otherwise stellar career, as he was victimized by both “The Drive” and “The Fumble” in consecutive AFC Championship Games. 

He was then Head Coach for the Kansas City Chiefs from 1989 to 1998, where they reached the AFC title game in 1993 but lost at Buffalo. Two of his Chiefs teams went 13-3 and locked up home-field advantage throughout the playoffs before flaming out in the divisional round.

After a single season with the Washington [Redacteds] in 2001, where he was fired by Dan Snyder, his final coaching gig was with the San Diego Chargers, under the equally odious Dean Spanos, from 2002 to 2006. He was fired after going 14-2 in 2006 because they were a #1 seed who lost their first playoff game. (By that measure, Dan Campbell should be sending out resumes and Mike McCarthy should never be let near another football team at all.) He was replaced by, of all people, Norv Fucking Turner, and Spanos tried to welch on the remaining $4.0 million Marty was owed but ultimately caved because opening his books would have been a “problem” at that time.

God, I hope that’s a stroke.

In all, Schottenheimer was 44-27 with Cleveland from 1984 to ’88; 101-58-1 with Kansas City from 1989 to ’98; 8-8 with Washington in 2001 and 47-33 with the Chargers from 2002 to ’06. The irony to those Chargers numbers is that, after Snyder fired Schottenheimer, the [Redacteds] went 33-47. (It’s not as good as Bill Walsh’s revenge on Paul Brown, but it did just fine.) 

Marty’s tree is quite impressive, since he often built it from scratch in his various locations.

Mikes McCarthy & Tomlin are doing the heavy work representing the Martyball lineage, but Cowher, Dungy & Arians make for a pretty good addition to the entourage. Marty’s ultimate legacy is still a pretty good representation of the good someone can do when they put time into developing the talent around them.


Mike Shanahan

Depending on who you talk to, Shanny belongs to either the Tom Landry coaching tree because of his work under Dan Reeves with the Broncos, or the Bill Walsh tree because of his work with George Seifert and being part of the Niners last Super Bowl (XXIX) in 1994. Both of these theories (purposely) ignore the fact that Al Davis had hired Shanahan away from the Broncos in 1987, only to fire him in 1989 due to personal conflicts – specifically with Art Shell, and that Dan Reeves hired him back, only to fire him in 1991 because of personnel conflicts – specifically with John Elway. It also omits the delightful fact that Elvis Grbac (remember him?!) says that in 1994 Shanahan ordered Grbac to throw the ball at Al Davis’ head during pregame warmups.

Either way, Shanahan leveraged his Niners coordinator success to land the Broncos job in 1995 after Wade Phillips was fired only two seasons after he’d replaced one of Shanahan’s mentors, Dan Reeves.

Denver’s where he made his legend, coaching there for 14 seasons, winning two Super bowls and paving the way for John Elway & Terrell Davis to qualify for the Hall of Fame. His ruining of RGIII was what cost him his last job, but he was interviewed by the Niners in 2015 before they decided to go with Jim Tomsula. One year of that, and then the failed Chip Kelly experiment, led them to hire Kyle Shanahan in 2017.

Meanwhile, the Mike Shanahan coaching tree,

weighs pretty heavily to the {Redacted} side of the equation these days, as people tend to focus on the new and shiny.

See?

Mind you, the Raiders side should be ignored, because Davis made him hire Art Shell, and the Broncos side is mostly retired & seems a little creepy based on all the K’s, despite the obvious Super Bowl success.

Still, that one branch has won one Super Bowl, and a lot of the others have had at least one kick at the head coaching can. Let’s take a closer look at a Very Special One.

Now, I want you to harken back to December 2022. It was a heady time – we were almost two years into what looked like the first of Joe Biden’s inevitable two terms; Donald Trump’s real estate company, the Trump Organization, was convicted of tax fraud in New York; and Caleb Williams of USC won the Heisman Trophy, hopefully leading to his eventual selection by an organization that would best utilize his talents. That same month, Vulture released an article that shook the landscape of modern entertainment – “How a Nepo Baby Is Born”.

To tie this into my main point, yesterday we looked at how coaching trees are like the “three generation rule“. Well, the Scottish version of the three-generation rule is, “The father buys, the son builds, the grandchild sells, and his son begs.” Well, here’s proof

of how true that adage actually is. Kyle Shanahan,

a kid from the wrong side of town who just happened to have a last name that a few people remembered…

Okay, fine.

Look, I think we all agree that his career really should have died after 28-3. But he’s managed to stick around the game long enough to profit off his name and his name’s reputation. Somehow, the blame fell on Dan Quinn for the fact that the Falcons stopped running in the second half.

One day after that debacle, Shanny Jr. signed with San Francisco. In Santa Clara he found a good situation that he seems (once again) unable to capitalize on. Working with John Lynch, they seem to have built a team with everything but a functioning quarterback. He’s suffered through Bryan Hoyer (inherited), Nick Mullens, Jimmy Garoppolo, C. J. Beathard, Trey Lance, and Brock Purdy, which is how he’s managed to turn prime Deebo Samuel & Nick Bosa into two lose-from-ahead Super Bowls. He has a contract that’s due to expire after the 2027 season, but if he doesn’t make it back to the Super Bowl after this season he’s set to lose a vast amount of talent to salary-cap crunches, and he might not want to stick around for the rebuild.

But what has happened is that his marginal success has turned into opportunities for others

to turn that opportunity into dogshit. DeMeco Ryans is currently the star of this group, but if the Texans can’t get past the first round he’s going to eventually hit that glass ceiling that exists only for black coaches and be fired, and then really replaced by Rex Ryan’s kid. Mike McDaniel is 2012 Mike Shanahan, because he’s managed to ruin a potential franchise quarterback. Finally, Robert Saleh is the Josh McDaniels of the group, having left for his own opportunity only to have it blow up in his face thanks to one man,

whose hubris, dreams, and random bouts of drug-induced psychosis the modern podcasting industry has turned into pronouncements from the Oracle of Delphi. And like Josh McDaniels, after getting canned Saleh went crawling back to his old team just so he could feel loved again. Who knows – if Jed York fires Shanahan Junior, Saleh may have found the one opportunity Josh McDaniels never could create for himself.

In short,


Tonight’s sports:

NHL:

  • Boston Bruins at New York Rangers – 7:00 PM – TNT; Sportsnet
  • Edmonton Oilers at Chicago Blackhawks – 9:30 PM – TNT; Sportsnet

NBA:

  • San Antonio Spurs at Atlanta Hawks – 7:00 PM – ESPN; TSN
  • Memphis Grizzlies at Toronto Raptors – 7:30 PM – Sportsnet1
  • Phoenix Suns at Oklahoma City Thunder – 9:30 PM – ESPN; TSN
  • Orlando Magic at Sacramento Kings – 10:00 PM – Sportsnet1

NCAA:

  • Duke at Syracuse – 7:00 PM – ESPN2
  • Arkansas at Texas – 9:00 PM – ESPN2

That’s three pretty good days down. Tomorrow’s going to be awful, but necessary.

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Beerguyrob
A Canadian man-child of indeterminate age, he stays young by selling alcohol at sporting events and yelling at the patrons he serves. Their rage nourishes his soul, and their tips pay for his numerous trips to various sporting events.
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Redshirt

I’ve said it before, I’ll say it again. The right to vote and procreate must be earned, not given.

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WCS

I thought personal responsibility and not being snowflakes and WOKE by complaining about bathrooms wasn’t an issue anymore, Indiana. SUCK IT UP

Brick Meathook

Pharmacy Bonus!

Actually it was K-P 24-hr urgent care in Tysons Corner, VA. If they make a new James Bond film then SMERSH Headquarters should be in Tysons because it is loaded with shiny new evil office high rises.

They gave me a bonus chest X-ray and pronounced me blessed with pneumonia. I got a fat dose of antibiotics and an inhaler and an invitation to come back tomorrow for another test and more medicine.

Fat chance! I’ll be smashed on booze and downers! I ain’t choking on no vomit though; that sort of behavior is undignified and beneath me.

Mr. Ayo

Wait, you got an inhaler? I only got the antibiotics. And no follow ups either.

I did have all the booze, though, so no hard feelings.

Horatio Cornblower

Former major leaguer Billy Hamilton, a native of Mississippi, is playing for Mexico in the Caribbean Series.

Finally, one of ours is taking one of their jobs!

Jimbo

-Billy Hamilton wow, the US isn’t sending their best.

Rikki-Tikki-Deadly

Next thing you know we’ll be sending Kellen Winslow Jr. and Aaron Hernandez.

Horatio Cornblower

Hamilton was fast as hell and fun to watch, but he couldn’t hit water if he fell out of a fucking boat.

Rikki-Tikki-Deadly

People said that about Natalie Wood but she vowed she would prove them wrong if it was the last thing she ever did.

Last edited 11 hours ago by Rikki-Tikki-Deadly
WCS

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2Pack

Ciao Tutti

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Doktor Zymm

The best part is how embarrassed the horse looks about how it’s drawn

Jimbo

He has inner beauty.

Gumbygirl
Brick Meathook

Oh boy! I’m at the pharmacy getting loaded up on prescription opiates. I’m looking forward to getting home, swallowing a fistful of them (doesn’t matter which), and washing them down with big swigs of Jim Beam.

The future’s looking good!

Don T

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Don T

Well, He did create leopards and cheetahs, and can tell their fur apart. So He’s either gay or a Latin woman.
/bows, blows big kiss

SonOfSpam

Viva dia!

SonOfSpam

(that’s probably wrong, but it’s only because speaking Spanish is illegal now)

Horatio Cornblower

Now?

SonOfSpam

Here, yes. Back East? Since the Sharks terrorized those nice Jets.

Horatio Cornblower

Officer Krupke didn’t deserve that shivving.

(he totally did)

Rikki-Tikki-Deadly

“I died for your sins but those pumps are unforgivable…”

christmas_shoes
Gatoraids
Doktor Zymm

YES!!!

Mr. Ayo

Civ VII early access already opened?

Doktor Zymm

Not until midnight, but sooooo close

Gatoraids

heard it unlocked a few hours early for quite a few people. pretending im going to resist the preorder markup

Doktor Zymm

You’re right! Download started! I should be able to start playing just about the time I ought to go to bed so tomorrow doesn’t suck lol

Don T

I’m fine with Saleh. And will never forget that Woody Johnson fired and had Saleh escorted out of the Jets building by security. Still think that was about Saleh wearing a Lebanon flag patch on the sidelines against the Vikes on a Sunday Mandatory. The Sporting News says that wasn’t the reason, but that outlet is mostly AI and a lock of Frank Deford’s pubic hair.

blaxabbath

I like Saleh. I mean, he went to the Jets. Todd Bowles saw what that place does to coaches and turned out fine (for the NFC South). Saleh had no hope.

BeefReeferLives

More absolutely top drawer work, BGR. It’s fascinating lil gems like this that keep me coming back for more:

“It also omits the delightful fact that Elvis Grbac (remember him?!) says that in 1994 Shanahan ordered Grbac to throw the ball at Al Davis’ head during pregame warmups.”

Oh yeah, baby. That’s the good shit right there…

(& I must say that your gif-fu is most impressive)

WCS

Protecting the borders!

blaxabbath

Guess we can count on all the other upper middle class young white men to foolishly volunteer to fight then. I was that stupid…. and also noticed no one else around my company was like me.

scotchnaut

No one was as stupid as you?

/ZING! POW! WOZZA!

SonOfSpam

These are the noises a knife makes when deflecting off a hobo’s sternum.

SonOfSpam

Yeah, I would’ve served, but I had a hair appointment that day. Although upon reflection, signing up woulda taken care of the hair thing. My loss.

Horatio Cornblower

Military service was not highly thought of in my family, that all-expenses paid tour of Vietnam that my father got back in the ’60’s not really reflecting well on the whole operation.

Once my father spoke at career day at my son’s elementary school, and when he was asked what career advice he would give the kids, (who, keep in mind, were 3rd graders), said “stay out of the infantry.”

That’s about when we stopped telling Dad about career day.

ballsofsteelandfury

Wow! Trump just banned trans athletes from competing in women’s sports!

Things are looking up

King Hippo

wake me when he PERSONALLY stiches Bruce Jenner’s wee-wee back on

Rikki-Tikki-Deadly

That’s awesome that should really solve a lot of American society’s actual problems. I saw that egg prices are already down by fourteen cents per dozen.

SonOfSpam

Yeah, what a nightmare this whole thing caused for absolutely no one.

ballsofsteelandfury

Have you not seen all the female athletes complaining about this? Have you not seen the teams refusing to play San Jose State in volleyball?

It’s not a nothing issue.

https://www.espn.com/college-sports/story/_/id/42549609/inside-san-jose-state-university-2024-volleyball-season-gender-fairness-safety

SonOfSpam

It’s a nothing issue.

No one who “cares” about this gives one single solitary shit about women’s sports.

Gatoraids

Hey some of them also care about removing Title IX for women sports too

SonOfSpam

Also, on the SJSU volleyball thing, I think it was that player’s 3rd season with the team, and SUDDENLY everyone cared? C’mon, this is more red meat for the inbreds.

ArmedandHammered

It became an issue when the trans player was spiking the ball incredibly hard, and here in NC one woman has partial facial paralysis and physical paralysis and impaired vision. There is a real safety issue.

Doktor Zymm

And if any other player had been doing that? Should other women not be allowed to compete just because they’re good at the sport?

Doktor Zymm

The whole premise of this issue is that *any* male is intrinsically better than *any* female, to the extent where competing together, even at the amateur level becomes unacceptably dangerous. That’s laughable, and to a large extent, manufactured.

People don’t associate competitiveness and .athleticism with femininity, so when a woman excels in a sport she’s seen as masculine, and possibly not a woman, but rather someone women need to be protected from. And when it’s a trans woman then it’s obviously because she’s not a ‘real’ woman.

Look at that whole Imane Khelif debacle, where people were calling her a man because she kicked some ass at boxing. And don’t even get me started on gender testing for track. It’s such BS.

ArmedandHammered

The power in the spike was a lot greater than a woman of the same age could generate. I am just saying, they may id as female, but they will be stronger and sturdier due to heavier bones and more power designed musculoskeletal system. Men are NOT better, just differently built by evolution.

Doktor Zymm

A) It’s college, and not an elite program. I guarantee you there are plenty of women out there of the same age who could generate the same power. You only really see differences when you get to the very highest levels, and even then they’re not as big as you might think when the women have equivalent training and opportunities.

B) HRT negates any physiological advantage and is frequently a disadvantage because they end up with less testosterone than naturally occurs in most women. This is measurably true. Also raises the question of what to do with women with naturally occurring high hormone levels.

C) About those equivalent opportunities, boys’ sports are far better funded and supported than girls’ sports, so one real reason trans women might have an advantage is because they have more experience and training. This isn’t a reason to ban them though, it’s a reason to support girls’ sports. Even at the Olympic level the medal disparity between countries that support women’s sports and those that don’t is huge, there’s a lot being left on the table in women’s’ athletics

Doktor Zymm

Oh, and mixed volleyball is a competitive sport, so how is that okay?

Also, not mad at anyone here, just salty about this issue in general because the entire history of women’s sports is filled with infantilizing crap. There’s no discernable reason for gender segregation in a lot of sports, especially at the lower levels. It’s a product of history that we’ve since rationalized by saying it’s about biology.

Doktor Zymm

It SHOULD be a nothing issue. People have yelled about competing with black athletes, gay athletes, athletes with various medical conditions, and female athletes even competing at all.

Just because bigots are yelling doesn’t mean I have to listen to them.

Last edited 14 hours ago by Doktor Zymm
Horatio Cornblower

I agree that women who have not fully transitioned have an unfair advantage over biological women and shouldn’t compete against them until they have completed the transition, and if that issue is the reason people are voting for Trump and making excuses for all the illegal/unethical shit his administration is doing well, this country is more fucked than I thought.

Rikki-Tikki-Deadly

Reminds me of how I used to whine about how a local high school always brought in “exchange students” who were ringers at sports, and how if the federal government had just put a stop to it my life would have turned out so very differently…

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g0cDp07uYP0

Last edited 13 hours ago by Rikki-Tikki-Deadly
blaxabbath

“Lowering food prices” is the new “and Mexico will pay for it.”

scotchnaut

I just banned Ray Bans from future Top Gun movies! Two idiots can play this game…

/Hold on a sec

Gatoraids

Judges are now looking up minors skirts. Trump still looking at for career opportunities for Gaetz I see.

blaxabbath

I’m not sure these middle-of-the-pack and worse alpha male athletes are going to enjoy seeing some tranny chick step on the court and beat them.

But whatever you guys want. I prefer to just be assumed better than a girl –i don’t actually want the opportunity to actually like lose to one.

Horatio Cornblower

As a mediocre high school cross-country runner who was beaten by girls on more than one occasion I wish I had the excuse of “Hurr, durr, well she used to be a guy, I’m sure of it”

But was I gonna do? Try harder? Fuck that; running up hills hurts.

ballsofsteelandfury

Love how the hate got ramped up. Can’t wait for tomorrow!

BeefReeferLives

& loathing is just around the corner…

Redshirt

COBRA!

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